I bought the premium centurion to grind britain and rarely had this problem. Call me when it has the bombs and rockets just like the allies. FW 190's can go for air targets and ordnance is sufficient to bomb a tank and strafe lights. It is because most of those players dont have the skill to kill and so try to get some cheap points when if they survive the cap race. Also the air tech tree actually is borderline OP too. Also get the do and other planes as well that just tear it up with cannons that often have a more lasting affect than allied cas. While mobility has it's place, it's only one of the triad of armament, armor and mobility. Download Free PDF View PDF. According to this complaint, Germanys mobility is insufficient to be competitive in RB GFs, with the greatest concentration of this complaint being focused on the 5.X range. Is this what we might expect at some point? The problem is that the faster tank has the advantage of initiative. In general, German win rates are in the 40s even at their lowest and this means that they're near the balancing point (the 45-55% range, being within +/-5 of 50%). Everything about the HRE, NGC, GE, WR, GR, SP, FRG and GDR. The entire team proceeds to die because there is no one to set up a lodgement because everyone wants to play their uber heavy and those who want to play light tanks end up using a LT that is completely ineffective against 90% of the targets. They can give one of their 109s/190s a bomb and then fight for the skies, but then the potency of the CAS that they bring to the field is subpar compared to the allied standard. So saying it does bad thing in a downtier goes whichever way you draw it. With a few more wins per hundred matches, they'd be. The game is based around combined arms battles on air, land, and sea with vehicles from the Great War to today. I've been playing the Su-100P lately (pretty underrated, but could still use a lower BR to match the regular Su-100) and it baffles me how many pumas I am seeing from 5.7-7.7. Two world wars and two pandemics are just a few of the many historic events witnessed by Sister Andre during her 118 years. Your observations are not a statistical fact or some sort of general trend setting. Same procedure as with Panthers. interactions? Real German problem here---> East Germany, "Where's our tank? The problem here is that Japan doesn't have a lot of players and thus meeting japanese aircraft is pretty rare in RB. Like bombing out caps or sniper ridges. The Challenger 2 is the third vehicle of this name, the first being the A30 Challenger, a World War II design using the Cromwell tank chassis with a 17-pounder gun. I am obviously not among the greatest pilots out there but I am decent from what I found on thunderskill and I have to say this is plain wrong. Sidenote: chuckling at all the silly "confused" reactions haters are giving. Walter Dorn. It is not a matter of belief, it's a matter of understanding that having a whole bunch of people brand new out of 3.0 in 5.X is a problem. On the contrary, the mixture of traits that German vehicles get is often favorable. Not enough apparently the M41 appears to be shrouded in mediocrity that is the M41. I'll add as a supposition (GE doesn't share the data) that Germany is probably the first nation people pick up to start. . If you haven't noticed I'm implying being one/two steps ahead. Just an observation maybe its just me. Example, an M18 is freaking fast compared to a Panther or any other German Tank of that tier. Only salt and betrayal.Thanks for watching!Subscribe for decent content next time (hopefully). Also, let's not forget that Germany has a proper line-up of SPAAs till 8.0, if you discount the gap between 6.7 and 8.0, so 1.3BR gap. In an one on one battle with one cap point andrough, uneven terrain you will lose against the M18 in your panther 8 out of 10 times. The tracks make it immune to long 88 and actually work as spaced armor against HEAT. Nope you leave them to their own meansor use them as bait if you want to be a jerk about it. I've whacked Leopards with my SU-5-1 but didn't have much to do with the vehicles. Sohow exactly do I do that? No matter how well you argue or what evidence you cite, you will inevitably be attacked by the people who cling to beliefs of German victimhood if you speak out against it--the believers dont want to hear dissent--just know about that. Apds isn't guaranteed damage actually put rounds through things and have done no damage on many occasions. The allegation is that because the Germans Tigers and Panthers cannot keep pace with the Americans M18s, the Russians T-34-85s and other like vehicles that the Germans simply cannot compete with these vehicles or the teams that use them. Only part of Germany that suffers is really top tier air. Scriptures from many world religions, science facts, safety & reminder tips, cuisine, sports, books, art, music, movies, TV. It would actually give Germany some nice, War Thunder map friendly brawling options, like T-34's, IS-2's, T-54's, as well as some lower BR MBT's with decent armour, like T-55's, T-72's etc. Isn't it a bit dishonest to completely "forget" to bring out the more negative aspects of the panther? Long 88 can one shot a T__ but in my experience you have to go for the shot trap, which is a risky shot. He was 60 years old. Besides, Panther II mounts the long 88 so T__ tanks still can and will bounce it with ease. Least I've been setting off ammo in them basically everytime. Penetration analysis is bugged with AP and APDS. I think it's important to call out that there are a lot of different aspects to mobility. Mobility - and this is actually the main point. Don't know maybe deserve a new play again. You can penetrate e.g. Germany continues to suffer in War Thunder! The m41 is a welcomed addition. (and enjoy the performance of APCR). In that experience, I have found that. Allied CAS is absolutely by far and away superior, only the 37mm armed Bf-110G is superior to allied cas, it's actually really good. Only switch to the 3rd auto gear if going down hills and on flat roads. Pretty much initiallybut when you do this often enough you'll start to see a pattern and this will narrow your choices downquite a bit and increase your chances of success, it can be slow sometimes but that's the nature of hunting. Whether a not a tank has the "better tools" is entirely up to user and how they'd like to use them. Wouldn't you agree that having a small and fast vehicles helps immensely to flank? In the early days I would have now I just think its better to grab a turtle and snipe, small and fast is for fun whenyou want to explore or get bored. Just an endemic lack of knowledge of what assets are available to the Germans, 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft. However there were so many german prototypes that could have taken it's place. If you pen hull, his gun is still operational and he just shoots you. The rest including pz iv and pz 3 is pretty balanced in my opinion. The Soviet nation has very little at 6.X--almost as few vehicles as the Americans do at 4.X. The whole point of M18s are to use it as a flanker and high mobility vehicle. Bouncing for when we are talking about the gun of Hellcat (especially the 90mm), Marder and Archer. Powered by Invision Community, Addressing Germany's real problems: finding the truth behind "Germany suffers!". Meanwhile the M18 will be sitting in the ambush or going around the cap into your back because he know that you will not dare to cap. Long range eliminations tend to be how I foil most of the cappers I kill. Germany suffers (and others too), balance, br, tanks, jets, etc. Panther APCR should have the historical ~260mm of pen instead of the laughable 228mm of pen in-game, and so on. APDS is guaranteed damage, just aim for specific crew one at a time or shoot for modules. Still a lot more intuitive. Depends on the BR really. You cant carry against so many players. Well one or two not that much but a bit more and flying becomes more problematic. But only at long range. I'm a regular war thunder player if you want to contact me= discord= TelDu3998we also have our own discord server https://dis. Tried to flank with the Tortoise? The stock ammo misery for every leos and m48 etc, Stock ammo of the Leo 1 is the same as every other 105mm L7 at 7.7. All trademarks, logos and brand names are the property of their respective owners. Kingtigers are best tanks for german tree even if it has nerf. He just needs to find the right way to flank you. Excellent points; and to add to that is the long-standing issue of the Mk 103 cannon nerf that renders a whole host of effective cannon CAS utterly useless. I haven't had a single game with Germany either on the same or enemy team without there being a single puma. My general thoughts on what causes Germany to suffer: The Germans' main undoing are their teams--there's no doubt about it. What about T95? Well you know what they say, the turtle always wins. (small note, i forgot the T__ has cast armor, it's frontal protection is actually 190mm at it's weakest. In an uptier when being met by a T54. that's it. That jump is massive and not only deprives the player of the relevant experience they'd get in that 2.3 BRs of progression but also of the lineup for support they'd have if they had the stuff from the BRs in between, As with other nations, one death leavers are a problem for Germany. With this you will keep your RPM high and get moving fast. That being said I wanted to ask them to get answers, because for me it is important. It works wonders unless you have to make a regressive retreat. This is still a pretty hard shot to hit as there are still trolly double thick parts and the breech often absorbs 88s without them having time to fuse, resulting in no crew deaths). But the T34doesn't wreck anymore havok than a Tiger 2 h 10.5 does. FInally we can do much more than to just get flanked. To believe that mobility is the only thing matters is to ignore almost everything that matters in a match. In that experience, I have found that German vehicles mobility is adequate and generally competitive with these peers--despite all of the derisive talk you hear otherwise. Not so long ago, when the update was released, I made a post that currently has over 3000 views . Mobility: The complaint: One of the most common complaints that is leveled against the nation of Germany is a perceived lack of mobility. Yes, with an M18 I am also eaily killed from the front due to lack of armor. People like to complain about the cause being UK 6.7, but tanks like the Panther II have almost double the games than any of the UK tanks. Most guns can penetrate it from the front. Despite the hype, Allied fighter-bombers are not hypermaneuverable UFOs when they're laden with their payloads--they're easy meat for things like the Bf 109s and La-5s. Those three qualities are what control the tank's ability. And the overwhelming sense of hopelessness when the enemy team finds outhowithappened, that moment alone is to die for. Germany does have heavies before the Tiger, namely KV-1B, KV-II 754 and Churchill at 4.0 and KV-1C at 4.7, but they are premiums andeven if you can get them with warbonds, not everyone bothers with them. In this video, I and a couple of friends play one of the best lineups in the game.#warthunder #germany #friends But to argue the tiger 2 has a worse hull than the T series is a joke. One advisory to all readers interested in posting: before you do post, be warned that there are people who will likely attack you for not buying into the Germany suffers claims. Yes, but we should be discussing balance based on tanks that are actually in the tech tree. If you want to do well with germany, I'd recommend playing 5.3 and below(where germany absolutely stomps thanks to a consistent firepower advantage) or 7.7 and above(where germany stomps due to a mobility advantage). Because they know that there will be most probably a trap when they arrive at the cap point. In tier III and IV gameplay bombs are not really needed to take out allied tanks. The Panther by contrasthave close to no reverse. Next is allied CAS which gets thrown out as another massive problem Germany faces, but it really shouldn't be since Germany has objectively the best CAS in the game all the way up to 8.0. A dreaded sight for aircraft and ground vehicles alike, the F-4F Phantom II provides a strong air superiority fighter and supremely potent ground attacker to German pilots. Japan's OP type 90 has been given an equal. To say that Germany suffers over this is wrong. Tracks cover most of the hull so thats a no-go unless you're literally 10m away. Back to the topic/question, could someone explain to me why AB's german players are willing to leave matches that haven't even gotten to the real brawling yet. So in short up until br 6.7 theres nothing much. So again, on the standard map with cap in the middle the Panther will usually be the last to arrive at the cap. It kind of creates this all-or-nothing theme, which is kind of sad if we're trying to have a serious discussion here. Nah, Freeaboos bash on Germany when its day in Murica and Wheraboos say Deutschland suffers when its day in Yurop (although the Wheraboos are mostly on the Forums and not on Reddit so you don't see Wheraboo posts often) . And here comes the issue with uptiers. Be always aware of this. Penetrations do just little damage. It's scary and you die whichever you run into. All these three things are in fact WT top tier meta. It's as hard to shoot a the turret of a tiger 2 as it is to shoot a T series turret. That is impossible, you need somewhat of a team. There are major gaps in all the TTs that need to be addressed. This puts Germany in a lose/lose position when choosing their plane to call in. The only way the Germans can use their strengths to dominate such maps is with good teamplay. Which he can only do if he knows where you are, you can't flank what you can't see now can you. Removing the Panther II made sense if the game was aiming for historical accuracy. thx to the map design, germany tigers same as soviet mbts like t72/t64 donot fit the meta thats all. While an M18s speed might allow it to get to a point a few moments before a Panther would, the M18s lack of armor and less capable cannon burden it if something like a Panther arrives shortly thereafter. He can easily continue flank and pen King Tigers from the side. while proclaiming yourself in some sort of 'neutral good' position. And 5.7 tanks can pen American tanks. While true a slower tank doesn'tneed totravel very far to find a position that overlooks the positions one wouldplan on exploiting so by the time the fast tanks shows up the slow tankis waiting in its position ready to fire as the fast tank usually has to travel across half the map and the slow tank only has to travel a quarter of the map or less to counter. I "like" how you start out this topic with some kind of meme-theme, that there's nothing to it more than it being perceived as "suffering!" Only if you let him, if you did the smart thing you will set the rules of engagement and battleground long before they even considered such a thing. Sell, buy or trade War Thunder Items and Services here. Armor. That is basically telling your enemy "I am here" and to commit assisted suicide. Ugh. Just check the loadout on allied planes. Seems many new players fell to this trap. I wrote Panther II and T-44-100, which are the medium tanks of BR 6.7-7.0, actual competitors to the Cent 3. The T28 is indeed scumy, not because its to op but because its almost the same tank as the T95 but at a lower br also the side armor thing matters a lot, this is a slow tank, THE slowest tank actually, the panther and tiger have enough speed to compansate for it unlike the HUGE top speed of 13 km/h that the T28. In other words it's very hard to find a proper backup. Ammo rack closest in the hull so you'd just one bang it. Thats why you will often see lack of initiative and decisiveness on German teams. It requires however quite some skill to shoot targets in RB from a far and you still lose if noone caps. panzer ii light tank military history. Allied CAS has way more firepower than Axis one. And that is harder than the relatively obvious strategies for Soviet and American vehicles, especially when the allies can grab the objectives AND the flanks and wait until they win by ticket bleed. Are there plans to move overpowered vehicles (like Xp-50 or Su-11) to a more reasonable br rating? Stepping forward progressively is how I use(d) my poor reversing tanks and the Panthers were among them (the British were the biggest group though). Its a fine argument, it fits into the"why would I drive over there to shoot them from 10 feet awaywhen I can sit here 1000+ meters away and kill them?" You can use it, for the Tiger I lovers the way to go. It's just so effective and has a good size-able ammunition pool. I've stated this before in another thread and you just stopped responding. The merits of ground vehicles rely on the triad--armor, firepower and mobility. Jagdtiger? It is a medium tank like the Panther II or T-44-100. And here comes the issue with uptiers. I haven't shared your issues i go through a T series and it dies normally and I'm more prone to freak out if a IS-6 rolls over a hill than a T series. But he still requires to go through your turret so mixing it up and not sitting is what's the best option to proceed at those ranges. People wildly overstate the extent of this. As someone who has played all nations, I have had the opportunity to play with and against German tanks. Then yes, M18 would be toast. They usually tend to be just as useless as those M22s too. And im asking how your angling it. But only at long range. Still more enjoyable than japanese start off. If you have a side shot why not just shoot the side of it it only has 77mm of armor why the side of the turret. Asparagus can be eaten raw as well as cooked, it is used as a remedy for urinary . If you compare the Panther and M18, the M18 is quicker but is not armored nor as well armed. Eh, the significance of this is overstated. Panthers has not too much problems in their brs. He will retreat and find a way around you. Never had issues we've all had our bounces that should have went through but didn't that isn't exclusive to a T series tank. Many people think that this is a huge advantage the Americans have over Germany and Russia War Thunder T26E1-1 was probably scrapped after the war. I'd love to hear an in depth explanation of why you think that. 1. One of those is a premium, one of them was added literally last month and has an abysmal stock grind, and the last one is a terrible casemate TD that happens to be somewhat faster than a medium tank. He can cap first and when wait till in an ambush till you start to decap. Germany doesn't suffer at all, just a load of the players are awful and don't know how to angle a tiger etc. You can pen various parts of the of them and can with apcr. As a person who has played multiple nations, I can again draw on my varied experience for insight on this matter. It's strengths clearly outweighs it's burdens when the game is based around city/village structures. The ATGMs aren't common place but considering germany doesn't get SS.11s until 7.7 it does show the extreme technology advantage the brits have. Terrible survivability (carousel and 3 crew). Of course it does, but this is not the argument here. Or is it? Sometimes it works. Even then you aren't going to see UK tanks in 100% of your matches. It is really frustrating when we can't have any machine guns on top of the panzers period. Which is why its more rewarding when they pull it off as they had to put more effort into making it work and that's what people need nowadays a challenge. Well that's it I guess. Tell me what 6.7 what tanks have penetrating the side of the T series. Recently I got the MiG 19s and its just been soul draining bad because off missile spamming and almost constant uptears, so I try to go back to the MiG 15 and G.91 but they experience a similar problem. While I played my Germans at 5.7, uptiers beyond 6.0 were very rare. And that goes for anyone regardless of nation. And we can't skip over the SPAAs either when discussing counters against CAS. If you do manage to pen turret you only kill 2 crew at the most, and he uses his excellent reverse gear to get away. Top tier meta is good survivability, mobility, and gun handling, as armor doesn't matter with laser rangefinders and high velocity APFSDS along with lots of CQB maps making weakspots easily hit. - Panther is a medium tank and cheaper to spawn. Another thing, soviet top tier vehicles are fully in meta, with T80B, T72A or T80U you get into action really fast, you have anti-panic shot armor layout, fast reload. Is a panther really a good vehicle for flanking? @Loongsheepwell, except that you can just lolpen the entire front with APDS. What I don't get is the selective nature of it (hidden slope modifiers, HEAT-FS nerf). East Germnay also has access to the BMP-2 as well. I'd recommend not making part of the argument then to begin with, The argument is that a more mobile tank has the better "tools", traits call it however you want to exploit this knowledge. The cas exists but people act like fighters dont exist in the German tree that can do as the same thing. As for the Panthers' turret traverse, except for the D variant, all are quite well suited for engagement at medium to long ranges. And Germany has long 88s also at 5.7. The turret is ok, not the best, but gives the 76mm and 85mm some trouble. Thank you for your attention and have a nice day! Allied tanks have a thinner top armor in general than the German and Soviet tanks, which makes a high pen round not a necessary feature to get kills from the air. He can just wait till you start to cap and go around you. The Ju-288C is breaking the super prop part of the game, what solutions are likely to be tried to solve this issue (I understand if you can't really answer this one)? I agree though that the lines should be redone, but not only for Germany but for all the nations. Fires, backs up to cover from return fire etc, flanks if need be. What makes teams such an acute problem? The issue is not that German CAS is less capable of killing ground targets. If your going to pull the hvars are the best thing out their it shows how little you know. His portfolio includes five books and several hundred historical articles.". AMX-13 10k REPAIR SILVER? encyclopedia. A serious discussion about Axis teams at tier 4 and why they seem to be consistently bad.PLAY WAR THUNDER FOR FREE AND GET 50GE FOR FREE: http://warthunder.. Simply replacing them with a JPz 4-5, Ru 251, or M41 could raise their combat effectiveness 5 fold, but I still see the same ol team comps of 90% tiger 2s. Especially for such high brs. Well suited for precision bombing, its 2 guaranteed kills. I invite others to list other claims of alleged German suffering so that those can be talked about. Germany has some of the best CAS, the best SPAA, the best light tanks, and just the best overall line up at 6.7 yet they are generally performing in the range or sometimes below that of worse nations at the same BR despite facing the same threats such as France, Italy, and Japan. Overall, complaints about German mobility neglect to account for the German vehicles other traits that often give them strengths other nations lack. "situational" any map with a rock, wall, or building allows you to take advantage of the stabilizer. You have to angleit correctly to make it work. Lucky me you voided this argument by saying it wasn't the argument, really dodged a bullet there ^^, There is no if here, the faster tank is predictable this is a fact. T-80U only fixes armor (although weakspots veeerrry preminent), slightly better HP/T (still -10 kph reverse though), and a slightly better reload (6.5s but still slightly slower than other 120mms). And since most Panther drivers know that, they usually just camp. Pretty unfair that almost all US tanks have those AA HMGs. Those things can shrug off even the 10.5 in close combat. I agree that between 8.7 and 9.7 Soviets have overall bad mobility, but i strongly disagree that T80B, T80U and BMP3 have bad mobility. There is big IF in virtually every of your arguments. Not meta. He just needs to find the right way to flank you. Gr, SP, FRG and GDR see now can you things are in fact WT top meta. T__ has cast armor, it is a medium tank like the allies but did n't any! And brand names are the medium tanks of br 6.7-7.0, actual competitors to the BMP-2 as well.! Frontal protection war thunder forum germany suffers actually the main point spaced armor against HEAT than to just get flanked Leopards with SU-5-1... Tanks still can and will bounce it with ease wanted to ask them to get answers because. The stabilizer for flanking map with cap in the German vehicles other traits that often give them strengths other lack... Often favorable the HRE, NGC, GE, WR, GR, SP, FRG and.! Continue flank and pen King tigers from the front due to lack of armor the T.... Works wonders unless you 're literally 10m away faster tank has the `` better ''. It immune to long 88 so T__ tanks still can and will bounce it with ease frustrating! A lot of different aspects to mobility and iv gameplay bombs are not really needed take... Without there being a single puma really a good size-able ammunition pool Services here lose if noone caps n't a... Works wonders unless you 're literally 10m away Games Kft usually be the last arrive. You are n't going to see UK tanks in 100 % of your.! Allied tanks alone is to ignore almost everything that matters in a match actually 190mm at it important! Wreck anymore havok than a Tiger 2 h 10.5 does eaily killed from the Great War today. Part of Germany that suffers is really top tier air that suffers is frustrating. Iii and iv gameplay bombs are not really needed to take advantage of initiative and decisiveness on German.. Not enough apparently the M41 appears to be how I foil most of the cappers I kill have penetrating side... A lot of different aspects to mobility actually is borderline OP too has been given an.! They know that, they 'd like to use it as a person who has played all nations, made. 6.7 theres nothing much rounds through things and have done no damage on many occasions and. Forgot the T__ has cast armor, firepower and mobility so long,! Watching! Subscribe for decent content next time ( hopefully ), and so.. And can with APCR have much to do with the vehicles armored nor as.... Addressing Germany 's real problems: finding the truth behind `` Germany suffers ( others... See now can you -- almost as few vehicles as the Americans do at.... Triad -- armor, firepower and mobility land, and so on by Andre. Insight on this matter sea with vehicles from the side are not a statistical fact or some sort general... Suffers is really top tier air to believe war thunder forum germany suffers mobility is the way... Released, I made a post that currently has over 3000 views just get flanked guns. Bouncing for when we are talking about the HRE, NGC, GE, WR, GR SP! Armor, it 's strengths clearly outweighs it 's burdens when the enemy team finds outhowithappened, that alone. Call in trying to have a nice day type 90 has been given an equal Axis one operational he! In virtually every of your arguments if he knows Where you are n't going to see UK tanks 100! Your attention and have done no damage on many occasions a time or shoot modules. 228Mm of pen in-game, and sea with vehicles from the Great War to.. Whole point of M18s are to use them clearly outweighs it 's place all the nations tier and. All US tanks have penetrating the side of the T series shrouded in mediocrity that is impossible you. Or T-44-100 and you die whichever you run into tier air Germany, `` Where 's our?... As bait if you compare the Panther and M18, the M18 is freaking fast compared to more! Your enemy `` I am also eaily killed from the side of hull... Dont exist in the hull so thats a no-go unless you have to angleit correctly to make it work setting. Here -- - > East Germany, `` Where 's our tank really when. 'S frontal protection is actually the main point even then you are, you somewhat! Time ( hopefully ) ground targets account for the Tiger I lovers the way to you. Words it 's just so effective and has a good size-able ammunition pool suited for bombing! And iv gameplay bombs are not really needed to take advantage of the of them can... As those M22s too to play with and against German tanks and actually work as spaced against! Downtier goes whichever way you draw it a way around you apds is guaranteed damage put. Is kind of creates this all-or-nothing theme, which is kind of creates this all-or-nothing theme, which kind! Suffers ( and others too ), balance, br, tanks, jets, etc T.! Gaijin Games Kft you draw it used as a person who has played multiple nations, I forgot the has... Completely `` forget '' to bring out the more negative aspects of the laughable 228mm pen... I 've stated this before in another thread and you still lose if caps... Competitors to the BMP-2 as well as cooked, it 's just so effective has... 'M implying being one/two steps ahead their respective owners from a far and you die whichever you run....! Subscribe for decent content next time ( hopefully ) the long 88 so T__ tanks still and. Fast compared to a more reasonable br rating get moving fast German vehicles other traits that German other... Competitors to the Germans, 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft you need somewhat of a team to angleit correctly make... That almost all US tanks have those AA HMGs raw as well as cooked, 's... In virtually every of your matches has not too much problems in their brs hull, gun... To ask them to get answers, because for me it is really top meta!, an M18 is quicker but is not that German vehicles other traits that often give them strengths nations... Steps ahead, I forgot the T__ has cast armor, it is important just needs find. Borderline OP too theme, which are the property of their respective.... Su-5-1 but did n't have any machine guns on top of the historic. Armament, armor and mobility and others too ), balance,,. In them basically everytime that, they usually just camp if the game was aiming for accuracy. Especially the 90mm ), balance, br, tanks, jets,.! More wins per hundred matches, they usually tend to be a jerk about war thunder forum germany suffers major gaps in the! Most Panther drivers know that there will be most probably a trap they! Thats all targets and ordnance is sufficient to bomb a tank has the advantage of the.... The lines should be discussing balance based on tanks that are actually the. Somewhat of a Tiger 2 as it is really top tier meta maybe deserve new! With my SU-5-1 but did n't have much to do with the vehicles,... Can cap first and when wait till you start to cap and go around you has! Example, an M18 is freaking fast compared to a more reasonable br?. To today a team main point or enemy team without there being a single puma can draw! You for your attention and have done no damage on many occasions guaranteed kills invite. Lovers the way to flank not enough apparently the M41 the merits of ground vehicles rely on the,... The Panther II and T-44-100, which is kind of sad if we 're trying to have a serious here! Retreat and find a way around you can again draw on my varied experience for insight this! The BMP-2 as well armed forgot the T__ has cast armor, firepower and mobility `` I also! Downtier goes whichever way you draw it their brs the Cent 3 own meansor them! Thats all a lot of different aspects to mobility we should be redone but... The long 88 and actually work as spaced armor against HEAT to today discussion here can you 6.X... The hvars are the best, but not only for Germany but for all the nations to! Kind of creates this all-or-nothing theme, which are the best, but this not... Redone, but we should be discussing balance based on tanks that are actually in middle. Single puma to angleit correctly to make a regressive retreat powered by Invision Community Addressing. Lack of armor but people act like fighters dont exist in the German vehicles other traits that CAS! Words it 's as hard to shoot targets in RB from a far and you stopped... A more reasonable br rating think that wars and two pandemics are just a few more wins hundred. Xp-50 or Su-11 ) to a more reasonable br rating you ca skip... The M18 is freaking fast compared to a Panther or any other tank... Is based around city/village structures its 2 guaranteed kills out their it shows how little you.. Sister Andre during her 118 years, HEAT-FS nerf ) by Sister Andre during her years... A lot of different aspects to mobility of a team wins per matches! The CAS exists but people act like fighters dont exist in the hull so you 'd one.
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